ITRCA

Hey guys-

I come from accross the way, Im rockin my boosted 2001 Prelude pushing 350whp (soon to be built). Im building it up for high boost but in the meantime the racing bug as got me. I want to up my game in the SCCA and race in ITR (improved touring class R). I want race an Integra Type-R but I am unfamilar with the best way to approach building a race ready TypeR. Since most ITR owners keep their cars looking nearly new, its hard to come by anything cheap to start with. I need a type-R (98-01)
-What should I expect to pay for a shell? / anybody selling a shell?
-Anybody have experience with top notch suspension? Looking at the TEIN race coilovers (anybody use these?). (suggestions that aren't resivior related)
-Whats the key to making these TypeR's really go around the track? (open question, if you have input lets hear it!)
-What should I pay for a block and transmission? I dont care if they need work or dont wory at all. I need one so people spread the word. (its a B18 right? I see like B18c, B18b...etc etc)
-Whats the transmission code that comes on the 98-01 typeR? I know its like S80......something something to do with the final drive 4.4 and 4.7


If you guys have any advice let me know! Thanks so much!

-Karl

First thought/suggestion...

Start reading here.

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread/766629

Id like some more first hand experience from seasoned racers. That FAQ is merely a guide to a bunch of threads that dont cover much real racing tech.

Racers, what works? Custom camber adjustments? 8.5'' wheels? cages incoorporating strut bars? come on something. Id hate to actually be the first one out there to start posting some intelligent race info before I even begin racing a car I have yet to build. I tell you that when my car is built that I will share everything Ive learned from my expierences. Ive had some track experience in IT7 and some hot lappin in friends cars and pace cars.

How about you start with specifics?

<--- who is not a seasoned racer, but a seasoned HPDEr lol
what are you looking for?

I could tell you plenty of what makes the car faster, but seat time is what makes the driver faster and better.
Suspension, 12/14 would be too soft for racing. (almost too soft for HPDE)
stock brake system works well up to a point, but getting a big brake kit will be eventually needed to run with the big boys.
saftey stuff, more the better.
wheels, 7 or 7.5 are popular. 225/45-15 good size for Rcomps.

Bbasso wrote:<--- who is not a seasoned racer, but a seasoned HPDEr lol
what are you looking for?

I could tell you plenty of what makes the car faster, but seat time is what makes the driver faster and better.
Suspension, 12/14 would be too soft for racing. (almost too soft for HPDE)
stock brake system works well up to a point, but getting a big brake kit will be eventually needed to run with the big boys.
saftey stuff, more the better.
wheels, 7 or 7.5 are popular. 225/45-15 good size for Rcomps.

Im searching for a coilover system or suspension combination that has proven itself on the track. Ideas? In SCCA ITR, we cant upgrade the brakes more than pads, fluid, and lines. NASA is different, I could run a solid 6 pot system under 15'' wheels. Im all about suspension adjustment and minimizes unsprung weight

I was looking at the Ksport RR system because of its camber adjustments but read up on those and saw that ksport copies other setups and tend to suck along with its warrenty. I love Koni's lifetime warrenty. thats what i run on my lude. TEIN flex suited for hardcore track? Or should I be looking at bilstein and such

BoostedBB6 wrote: -What should I expect to pay for a shell? / anybody selling a shell?

$1k to 5k depending omcondition and what is still on the car.

BoostedBB6 wrote: -Anybody have experience with top notch suspension? Looking at the TEIN race coilovers (anybody use these?). (suggestions that aren't resivior related)

Koni Race Yellows is tough too beat.
PIC select
Mugen or Spoon N1

BoostedBB6 wrote: -Whats the key to making these TypeR's really go around the track? (open question, if you have input lets hear it!)

They do pretty good on their own but bigger rear sway bars. Staggered wheel setups and tire pressures are what I use for more rotation.

BoostedBB6 wrote: -What should I pay for a block and transmission? I dont care if they need work or dont wory at all. I need one so people spread the word. (its a B18 right? I see like B18c, B18b...etc etc)

$3k-5k

BoostedBB6 wrote: -Whats the transmission code that comes on the 98-01 typeR? I know its like S80......something something to do with the final drive 4.4 and 4.7

S80. JDM is 4.785 FD and USDM is 4.4FD

BoostedBB6 wrote: TEIN flex suited for hardcore track?

Not to my knowledge. I have never heard of anybody with positive things to say about Tein and track use together.

get RIGHT wrote:

BoostedBB6 wrote: TEIN flex suited for hardcore track?

Not to my knowledge. I have never heard of anybody with positive things to say about Tein and track use together.

Gil is using a tein setup on his car. HT is down so I can reference what his specs are. In either case, it still could be Apples to Oranges depending on class rules etc. I would have said:

get RIGHT wrote:Not to my knowledge. I have never heard of anybody with positive things to say about KSport and track use together.

BoostedBB6 wrote: Im searching for a coilover system or suspension combination that has proven itself on the track. Ideas? In SCCA ITR, we cant upgrade the brakes more than pads, fluid, and lines. NASA is different, I could run a solid 6 pot system under 15'' wheels. Im all about suspension adjustment and minimizes unsprung weight

I was looking at the Ksport RR system because of its camber adjustments but read up on those and saw that ksport copies other setups and tend to suck along with its warrenty. I love Koni's lifetime warrenty. thats what i run on my lude. TEIN flex suited for hardcore track? Or should I be looking at bilstein and such

More and more people are using PIC coilovers. Their customer service is bar none! They support the community that supports them, for sure!

What 6 pot system is going to fit under 15" wheels? To the best of my knowledge, none will. Any info on the ones your considering?

Also, how much track time/experience do you have under your belt? I ask, because learning the car in stock/close to stock form is much easier than trying to mod to driver A's style, when your like driver B. Personally, I like quite a bit of oversteer, but some prefer a neutral or understeer car.

Specifically speaking of the ITR's brakes, they are great stock. From there, the SS lines, a good fluid like ATE Superblue and some pads should do the trick for now (unless again you have a TON of track time) While I used to suggest Cobalt Spec VR's for track duty, they are no longer made and switched to different compounds of which I have yet to try. But definitely a more agressive pad should do the trick for you.

thats the sort of thing i need to hear. after looking at the PIC selects, I'm beginning to like them for the price. I also like how I can choose the spring rate!

On another note. Im trying to understand the discrepancies between the TypeR suspension components and the regular GS/LS/GSR suspension. Im looking at sway bars and control arms. Some sites say their product does not fit to a TypeR. Are there certain aftermarket parts that will not match up to a typeR unless its specifically made for the typeR? does the typeR have 2 sets of lower control arms? and maybe the rears on the typeR are different? Ive looked at the Password JDM arms because they have speherical bearings in them. Sadly they say theirs dont match up to TypeR.

please help me understand!

The diff is the ITR LCA's are different than other Integras. The shock goes thru the rear LCA on the ITR's. I believe the front lower control arms are also slightly longer since our car's came lowered than all the rest.

Im trying to find aftermarket lightened LCA's (preferably with speherical bearing bushings) So will i have any luck finding any? Most aftermarket LCA's are made slightly shorter to adjust for lowered cars. So would that mean that I could replace the front LCA's no problem? and the rears are entirely different and require TypeR - made LCA's?

As mentioned the "geometry" is a little different on the ITR's vs the other DC2 chassis models.

The LCA's are different, however companys like PIC offer both "stock" replacements and "Fork" style replacements. You would have to run different LCA's to run their fork style. I personally have the forks and wouldn't look back myself.

Some LCA companies that come to mind are Function 7, PIC and others. Take a look at what you personally like and go from there. Remember too, some companies offer spherical bearings for replacements so you could go with company A's LCA and company B's bearings.

Dave_B wrote:As mentioned the "geometry" is a little different on the ITR's vs the other DC2 chassis models.

The LCA's are different, however companys like PIC offer both "stock" replacements and "Fork" style replacements. You would have to run different LCA's to run their fork style. I personally have the forks and wouldn't look back myself.

Some LCA companies that come to mind are Function 7, PIC and others. Take a look at what you personally like and go from there. Remember too, some companies offer spherical bearings for replacements so you could go with company A's LCA and company B's bearings.

So I can buy PIC 'fork style' replacement LCA's with regular aftermarket LCA's like function 7 (since most aftermaket DC LCA's are shortened) and that will work on the TypeR?

Im looking at Skunk2 upper camber adjustment. has +-5 degrees camber asjustments. I believe that is plenty. Is there a company out there that make sperhical bearing kits for ITR's?

Out of curiosity, how much seat time do you have?

Bbasso wrote:Out of curiosity, how much seat time do you have?

I road race in IT7 right now. 2nd year now. first gen RX7's. rotary setups without independent rear suspensions is so different from what I drive daily (boosted BB6 prelude). Im using what i know from my car and trying to translate it into this car im about to build. on our cars we have to run anywhere from up to 7-8 degrees camber. Im assuming 5 is enough for this teg. why are you so concerned with seat time? yes seat time makes a driver but beyond that setup/adjustability/reliability is everything to me

BoostedBB6 wrote:why are you so concerned with seat time?

I'm not "so" concerned with your seat time, just wanted to know.

Sounds like you need to make the car stock first and then see what you want to improve.
Most of the HPDErs are very happy with the basic stuff, PIC, sway bars and tires.
As for the racing end of it, I'd look on a more specific forum and search around for specs on what they run on their integra(s).
I could suggest a bunch of items, but not knowing your driving stlye my settings might get you killed
(for track I like it on the edge- my driving stlye)

After driving my FWD prelude ive learned what suspension mods work and what dont. Like you said sway bars, tires, coilovers are all great starts. After building my first cage in my RX7 I wished Id incoorportated the cage into also being a rear tower bar. Aside from those mods Im probably going to be putting a 3 point front tower bar, as many spherical bearings in my suspension, and any aftermarket suspension piece that 1. allows adjustment 2. reduces unsprung weight.

I'll have to dig up or take some pics of the rear of my cage for you.

According to the rules at the time (Honda Challenge) you could not have the horizontal bar touching or connected to the shock towers, so I went about 2" up and made the horizontal.

Dave_B wrote:I'll have to dig up or take some pics of the rear of my cage for you.

According to the rules at the time (Honda Challenge) you could not have the horizontal bar touching or connected to the shock towers, so I went about 2" up and made the horizontal.

please do. For some reason I thought it was illegal in SCCA IT as well so that is why I didnt do it but now I know we can. Have the rules changed for Honda Challenge too?

Some rules have changed... I just haven't kept up on them lately.

ok now heres an interesting question:

final drive.....4.7 or 4.9.

hell maybe you know a track where one would prevail over the other? lets see what yall have to say

FD will depend on your power output and redline.
I had the 4.9 on a basically stock R and while it was fun I lost 3mpg on long distance trips and more revs at cruising speed.
I'm sure it would be nice on track, sadly I never had the chance, but I am happy with the 4.4 for all around use.

yeah Im looking at gettin a 4.9. I think it would be wild on the track and in Honda Challenge with a lightened flywheel it would be off the chain