Getting started in HPDE/Professional Driving

[BebopIntegra]

If this question has been asked on here, I apologize, as I didn't see it when looking for a topic on it.

I figured since a lot of you are professional drivers in one way or another, this would be the best place to go for this kind of advice.

Ever since I went to Expo 10 and the Team-Integra Dragon Run after that, I've been wanting to improve my driving skills, and find a place that I can drive my call all out, since the street is obviously a bad place to do this. When Ramzi observed my driving at Dragon, he recommended I look into HPDE, which I have done.

Now, I'm currently a college student with a job that isn't exactly steady money, but it's something I like to do. I live in the northern part of Illinois, around the same area as Jay.

My question to everyone here is, how exactly should I go about starting out with this? I've been doing research on the NASA site, and it seems the obvious choice would be to save up for a learning day at Autobahn and go from there.

However, considering my budget, I'm wondering if there isn't an alternative to that, such as attending the next Expoas an actual driver this time, or doing a few auto x's, that sort of thing. I don't want it to seem like I'm trying to cheap out on actually learning to drive; if going to Autobahn and learning from them is what I need to do, then I'll do that. However, it would be nice to hear from the rest of you any opinions that my help me out.

Thanks everyone.

- Steve

[coolhandluke]

Steve,

Only a handful of us here compete professionally. The percentage of those here who track are far higher than most forums. Some of us may track once a year, annually at ITR Expo. Others may track as much as 2-3 times a month and be NASA/PCA certified instructors. This is an expensive hobby too. Between car maintenance, transportation costs, and track fees...it adds up. My best advice is to just start attending track days. Often then are only $5-15. You can create some some friendships at the events and work on getting ride alongs. Ride alongs are essentially free track time. And there is no need to rush yourself. You have plenty of time to track.

[WheelPowerRacing]

If there are events in your area, start by Autocrossing. Auto-X is inexpensive ($30 an event) and teaches great car control. It will amaze you how intense a parking lot full of cones can get when driving against the clock. The benefits pay off on track as you are used to the feeling of tires losing and regaining traction, controlling the car in a slide, when to apply throttle, awarness of car position & attitude, etc. I know my Auto-X experience has saved me multiple times on track and on the street, when things could have gotten out of control.

[itrsteez]

Steve,

If money is tight then do corner worker stuff for free track time... I'm not sure where you're located, but you'll get a feel for what to expect at a track day and you'll know all of your flags so you'll have a huge leg up on the safety protocol stuff. Where are you located?

[BebopIntegra]

Steve,

If money is tight then do corner worker stuff for free track time... I'm not sure where you're located, but you'll get a feel for what to expect at a track day and you'll know all of your flags so you'll have a huge leg up on the safety protocol stuff. Where are you located?

I'm up in Crystal Lake, which is in McHenry County, about two hours north of Autobahn.

[itrsteez]

Steve,

If money is tight then do corner worker stuff for free track time... I'm not sure where you're located, but you'll get a feel for what to expect at a track day and you'll know all of your flags so you'll have a huge leg up on the safety protocol stuff. Where are you located?

I'm up in Crystal Lake, which is in McHenry County, about two hours north of Autobahn.

If you want to try volunteering with NASA your local region will be the great lakes region
http://www.nasagreatlakes.com/

[stinkycheezmonky]

You're also fairly close to Road America, which is another great track. Corner working + autoxing are my suggestions as well. To find out more about corner working opportunities, you'll want to contact the registrar for your NASA region, which looks like Linda Royce here: http://www.nasagreatlakes.com/contact/

Ride-alongs will also be helpful, as you'll be able to see first-hand the right way to get around a track, how to respond to different situations, etc.

[cheezthis]

Sign up for WMHM whenever registration opens. The Novice spots usually fill fast. Gingerman isn't much further than Autobahn and is a good track to learn on. Plus, you'll be surrounded by a bunch other Honda dorks there.

Get your car prepped to a safe point where all the maintenance is up to date. That's a key part. You don't need to make it faster, just reliable.

If you can't wait until WMHM next July, sign up for some other events. SCCA and TSSCC have a lot of auto-x events at Joliet and Miller Park in Milwaukee. There will also be some other club events at Autobahn as well, but I haven't checked the schedule. SCCA PDX will probably have a few again this year as an example.

[Doespike]

I second Jay's vote for WMHM...plenty of us dorks there WMHM is like an Expo atmosphere where you can find your own comfort pace on track and have a ball. I personally started off with Expo for tracking and branched out to WMHM before eventually hitting up BMWCCA and NASA events. I'm glad I got my feet wet with Expo and WMHM first....the later events really push you though.

Again, like Jay said, safety and reliability is key. A stock car is probably best for popping that track cherry....few variables other than the loose nut behind the wheel.

Good luck and welcome mang :toast:

[BebopIntegra]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate all of your input. I will take everyone's advice into consideration while doing more research on what I should do. Everything you guys have mentioned would be something I'd be willing to do.

And yeah, making my car go faster isn't what I'm aiming for right now, as tempting as it sometimes is. I still don't know what exactly my goals are, and a lot more research needs to go into it before I even get there. As it stands, I'm working on getting some new Stoptech brakes, a new set of rotors, and replacing all of the suspension and shifter bushings in my car with Hardrace; like you guys said, reliability stuff.

:Cheers:

[pasaunde1]

Don't forget about the brake fluid. I wouldn't replace the OEM bushings unless they are busted, there are plenty of people going fast on and prefer OEM bushings.
Stock Rs are exceptional track cars so besides replacing wear items seat time is the single biggest bang for the buck..... good luck.

[BebopIntegra]

I replaced the brake fluid less than 10,000 miles around with the Motul 600 stuff. Also, I don't have an R; I have a 98 GS-R sedan with a motor that was rebuilt to OEM spec 20,000 miles ago.

What I do plan on doing after it warms up is transmission fluid.

[coolhandluke]

FYI it is recommended to change that brake fluid once a year. If you have 10k on that fluid you are probably due for a brake fluid flush.

[BebopIntegra]

FYI it is recommended to change that brake fluid once a year. If you have 10k on that fluid you are probably due for a brake fluid flush.

Thanks, I know. I actually changed it at the Dragon, so it was about 7000 miles ago give or take. I plan on doing a gravity bleed the next time it's changed.

[coolhandluke]

Please don't waste your time with a gravity bleed. Just do it right the first time and properly bleed your brakes.

[BebopIntegra]

Please don't waste your time with a gravity bleed. Just do it right the first time and properly bleed your brakes.

What's wrong with a gravity bleed? I've heard good things about it, but all the same, I'm all ears. My brakes were bled the proper way when I changed them at the Dragon by the way.

[coolhandluke]

I hope none of this sounds/sounded condescending, but it isn't an effective way to bleed your clutch or brake system.

[BebopIntegra]

I hope none of this sounds/sounded condescending, but it isn't an effective way to bleed your clutch or brake system.

Not at all, but I'm curious as to why. Whenever people talk about it, they describe the results as having a very firm brake pedal, more so than when done the normal way. This is the first time I've heard something negative about it, so like I said, I'm curious.

[cheezthis]

If the pedal is firm, even after a couple of heated laps, then do whatever works. We all have methods to our madness. Some ideas:

- dealers use a vacuum setup that works relatively well
- gravity bleed is common with some race teams, at least, it was when I watched some old World Challenge teams
- I have a method that requires two people, one holding pressure on the pedal (usually Chris, thanks yo!), while the other hits the caliper with something like a rubber mallet before opening the bleeder. Repeat that a couple of rounds on all 4, and you're set. Usually that route allows me to go all year without needing to re-bleed.

[KOALA YUMMIES]

Steve,

If money is tight then do corner worker stuff for free track time... I'm not sure where you're located, but you'll get a feel for what to expect at a track day and you'll know all of your flags so you'll have a huge leg up on the safety protocol stuff.

I second this. I did corner work for first few times I went out. Got free track days with the same organization, free lunch (they better!) and learned a lot. The cool thing is, if you do it enough and get to know the people with the organization, you can 'graduate' to tech-inspections, then you only work very early in the morning, and can track the rest of the day (for free!).

As Stinkycheezmonkey said, ask for ride-alongs, especially with instructors. Thank them a lot, and tell them how awesome it was. That way you'll be more likely for a second ride, over the other guy who didn't thank, and say how awesome it was.

Don't worry about making the car fast. Get out on track with the car as it is, do it a lot and get a whole bunch of track experience. You won't regret it, my guess is, after your first day, you'll be hooked.

[BebopIntegra]

Steve,

If money is tight then do corner worker stuff for free track time... I'm not sure where you're located, but you'll get a feel for what to expect at a track day and you'll know all of your flags so you'll have a huge leg up on the safety protocol stuff.

I second this. I did corner work for first few times I went out. Got free track days with the same organization, free lunch (they better!) and learned a lot. The cool thing is, if you do it enough and get to know the people with the organization, you can 'graduate' to tech-inspections, then you only work very early in the morning, and can track the rest of the day (for free!).

As Stinkycheezmonkey said, ask for ride-alongs, especially with instructors. Thank them a lot, and tell them how awesome it was. That way you'll be more likely for a second ride, over the other guy who didn't thank, and say how awesome it was.

Don't worry about making the car fast. Get out on track with the car as it is, do it a lot and get a whole bunch of track experience. You won't regret it, my guess is, after your first day, you'll be hooked.

It's definitely up there on my list. And my car is fast enough with the fresh motor, I'm not worried about the speed.

And I was hooked the day I went to Expo 10 this year. That and driving the Tail of the Dragon in July.