ITRCA

I just recently puchased my baby and have always wanted to turbo a type-r. I'm looking for any and all information pertaining to turbo'ing this bad boy. Im also looking for anyone getting rid of their set up for a decent price.

I've been doing a lot of reading on this website and feel that every member is competent and resourceful.

Please help me out. Point me in the right direction.

My advice... stay NA LOL

Bbasso wrote:My advice... stay NA LOL

I'll second that. In retrospect i should have got a cheap ls integra instead of my gsr which I have almost completely replaced every part for a pretty serious turbo setup.

I own a jdm 96spec R and I just feel they were meant to be n/a beasts.

No disrespect to the boosted R's out there.

Bbasso wrote:My advice... stay NA LOL

Ahem, this is not hondar tech...lol.

OP, you can make 250 whp and reliable power mind you, on the most simplest of setups. People have made more on stock engines. I would suggest replacing your headgasket in an attempt to lower your compression ratio and get some ARP headstuds. Boost owns JOO, and FTW

I found this awhile ago and have been reading it almost everyday....what do you guys think?
EK_Hatchy
09-19-2002, 09:25 PM
what u guys fail to realize is that boosting at a uniform psi, say 7 psi on 9:1 compression and 10.6:1 compression, the 10.6:1 is gonna mop the floor.

Personally, I see NOTHING WRONG with wanting to turbo a Type-R motor? Who cares if it was built for "all motor" and that kinda BS? Its their motor, let them do what they want. Anyone serious about a turbo setup is going to rebuild the internals ANYWAY.

Lets see, with the type-R motor u get:

LSD
A great tranny (eff the LS tranny and "oh but u stay in boost longer" bs)
Great T/b and intake manifold
Factory port and polished head
good cams and valvetrain

BUT, you could probably buy 4 b18bs for the price of one b18c5! why not save the money?
Ryan Autry
09-19-2002, 11:47 PM
I love High compression and Boost.

One main concern in power production with forced induction is effective compression. Effective compression is the sum of the motors static compression, plus the additional compression added by the forced induction tool. A B18C1 (also B16A) motor will have a higher effective compression than a B18B motor will, on the same boost...therefore, pound for pound, it will make more power.

The next argument that people usually bring up is that a higher compression is bad for turbocharging. Well, if you understand the concept of effective compression, then you should understand that this statement is entirely incorrect. A higher compression engine makes more power in NA form. So, why do you turbo guys think that a lower compression turbo motor makes more power? Does that make any sense when you really think about it? A turbocharger is a power adder? So why deplete power that was there to begin with? The answer I usually get to that is "So I can run more boost!" Well, sorry to rain on your parade, but more boost does not always equal more power. Check out this mathematical example of effective compression:

A motor with a 10.0:1 static CR boosting 10psi
10psi/14.7psi = .68
.68 + 1 = 1.68
1.68 x 10 = 16.8 effective CR

A motor with an 8.5:1 static CR boosting 10psi
10psi/14.7psi = .68
.68 + 1 = 1.68
1.68 x 8.5 = 14.28 effective CR

Now tell me who is going to make more power? The higher CR motor, or the lower CR motor?

So, maybe add more boost to the lower CR motor, right? Wrong...

A motor with an 8.5:1 static CR boosting 13psi
13psi/14.7psi = .88
.88 + 1 = 1.88
1.88 x 8.5 = 15.98 effective CR

Now you see, even adding 3psi of boost, still does not equal the effective CR of the higher compression, lower boost motor.

Effective compression is not the only advantage of the B16A/B18C1 either. The B16A/B18C1 has a stronger, better flowing cylinder head. It can rev much higher, making it that much more effective, and it flows great to handle all of the extra volume. The block has oil squirters to help support the bottom end assembly at high RPM. It takes more than a valvetrain upgrade to make a B18B safe at 8k. The higher compression also aids in spooling the turbo faster too.

Both motors have similar tolerances though. Both motors pretty much top out at around 350-400hp on stock motors, very well tuned. The B18C1 will make it far more efficiently for you though. It takes less boost to do so, it has more safeguards...and the bottom line on any Honda motor is tuning. If it is well tuned, you will be set. That goes for both motors. YOU ARE A FOOL if you think for one second that just because your B18B has a lower compression, you can substitute that for proper tuning.

A lot of people like to lower their motors compression when they build their motor. I used to think it was a good idea before I understood about tuning, and the positive aspects of compression. In the mathematical representation below, I will show you how a low compression motor must boost more to equal the output of a higher compression, lower boost motor:

Motor: stock B16A2 boosting 7psi.
Static Compression Ratio: 10.4:1

((boost psi / 14.7) + 1) x motor compression = effective compression

Stock motor (10.4:1 CR) on 7psi:
7psi/14.7psi = .47
.47 + 1 = 1.47
1.47 x 10.4 = 15.288 effective CR

Built motor (9.0:1 CR) on 7psi:
7psi/14.7psi = .47
.47 + 1 = 1.47
1.47 x 9 = 13.23 effective CR

You will lose 2.058 points from your effective compression ratio, this translates to a significant power loss.

In order to gain back that power, you have to do this:

Built motor (9.0:1 CR) on 10.5psi:
10.5psi/14.7psi = .71
.71 + 1 = 1.71
1.71 x 9 = 15.39 effective CR

Add 3.5psi to what you were boosting before, and you should be able to make around the same power as before, granted you haven't done any other kinds of modifications port/polish, cams, etc...

As you can see, considering all things stay equal (bore/stroke/cylinder head/etc...), you must add 3.5psi to make the motors perform similarly. You just spent about $2,500 to build your bottom end, and make your car slow.

By now we all should understand the positive aspects of compression, and how when teamed with the faster spoolng turbo, more efficient output, better flowing B-series VTEC cylinder heads, better low end spool time, stock oil squirters, higher redline, etc...you should see that turbocharging B-series VTEC motors is clearly not dangerous, and highly adviseable. I love a good turbo B16A

braidan_s wrote:I found this awhile ago and have been reading it almost everyday....what do you guys think?
EK_Hatchy
09-19-2002, 09:25 PM
what u guys fail to realize is that boosting at a uniform psi, say 7 psi on 9:1 compression and 10.6:1 compression, the 10.6:1 is gonna mop the floor.

Personally, I see NOTHING WRONG with wanting to turbo a Type-R motor? Who cares if it was built for "all motor" and that kinda BS? Its their motor, let them do what they want. Anyone serious about a turbo setup is going to rebuild the internals ANYWAY.

Lets see, with the type-R motor u get:

LSD
A great tranny (eff the LS tranny and "oh but u stay in boost longer" bs)
Great T/b and intake manifold
Factory port and polished head
good cams and valvetrain

BUT, you could probably buy 4 b18bs for the price of one b18c5! why not save the money?
Ryan Autry
09-19-2002, 11:47 PM
I love High compression and Boost.

One main concern in power production with forced induction is effective compression. Effective compression is the sum of the motors static compression, plus the additional compression added by the forced induction tool. A B18C1 (also B16A) motor will have a higher effective compression than a B18B motor will, on the same boost...therefore, pound for pound, it will make more power.

The next argument that people usually bring up is that a higher compression is bad for turbocharging. Well, if you understand the concept of effective compression, then you should understand that this statement is entirely incorrect. A higher compression engine makes more power in NA form. So, why do you turbo guys think that a lower compression turbo motor makes more power? Does that make any sense when you really think about it? A turbocharger is a power adder? So why deplete power that was there to begin with? The answer I usually get to that is "So I can run more boost!" Well, sorry to rain on your parade, but more boost does not always equal more power. Check out this mathematical example of effective compression:

A motor with a 10.0:1 static CR boosting 10psi
10psi/14.7psi = .68
.68 + 1 = 1.68
1.68 x 10 = 16.8 effective CR

A motor with an 8.5:1 static CR boosting 10psi
10psi/14.7psi = .68
.68 + 1 = 1.68
1.68 x 8.5 = 14.28 effective CR

Now tell me who is going to make more power? The higher CR motor, or the lower CR motor?

So, maybe add more boost to the lower CR motor, right? Wrong...

A motor with an 8.5:1 static CR boosting 13psi
13psi/14.7psi = .88
.88 + 1 = 1.88
1.88 x 8.5 = 15.98 effective CR

Now you see, even adding 3psi of boost, still does not equal the effective CR of the higher compression, lower boost motor.

Effective compression is not the only advantage of the B16A/B18C1 either. The B16A/B18C1 has a stronger, better flowing cylinder head. It can rev much higher, making it that much more effective, and it flows great to handle all of the extra volume. The block has oil squirters to help support the bottom end assembly at high RPM. It takes more than a valvetrain upgrade to make a B18B safe at 8k. The higher compression also aids in spooling the turbo faster too.

Both motors have similar tolerances though. Both motors pretty much top out at around 350-400hp on stock motors, very well tuned. The B18C1 will make it far more efficiently for you though. It takes less boost to do so, it has more safeguards...and the bottom line on any Honda motor is tuning. If it is well tuned, you will be set. That goes for both motors. YOU ARE A FOOL if you think for one second that just because your B18B has a lower compression, you can substitute that for proper tuning.

A lot of people like to lower their motors compression when they build their motor. I used to think it was a good idea before I understood about tuning, and the positive aspects of compression. In the mathematical representation below, I will show you how a low compression motor must boost more to equal the output of a higher compression, lower boost motor:

Motor: stock B16A2 boosting 7psi.
Static Compression Ratio: 10.4:1

((boost psi / 14.7) + 1) x motor compression = effective compression

Stock motor (10.4:1 CR) on 7psi:
7psi/14.7psi = .47
.47 + 1 = 1.47
1.47 x 10.4 = 15.288 effective CR

Built motor (9.0:1 CR) on 7psi:
7psi/14.7psi = .47
.47 + 1 = 1.47
1.47 x 9 = 13.23 effective CR

You will lose 2.058 points from your effective compression ratio, this translates to a significant power loss.

In order to gain back that power, you have to do this:

Built motor (9.0:1 CR) on 10.5psi:
10.5psi/14.7psi = .71
.71 + 1 = 1.71
1.71 x 9 = 15.39 effective CR

Add 3.5psi to what you were boosting before, and you should be able to make around the same power as before, granted you haven't done any other kinds of modifications port/polish, cams, etc...

As you can see, considering all things stay equal (bore/stroke/cylinder head/etc...), you must add 3.5psi to make the motors perform similarly. You just spent about $2,500 to build your bottom end, and make your car slow.

By now we all should understand the positive aspects of compression, and how when teamed with the faster spoolng turbo, more efficient output, better flowing B-series VTEC cylinder heads, better low end spool time, stock oil squirters, higher redline, etc...you should see that turbocharging B-series VTEC motors is clearly not dangerous, and highly adviseable. I love a good turbo B16A

All of this is great , if you are building a " built" motor , wit stick compression ratio ,

or as you said , a stokc motor on boost

but you are correct with everything

Congrats on your new car man!!! You'll love the car boosted without a doubt. I cant help you with the for sale items but we can help you with any other info you need. Do a search in this section and you'll see tons of info.

And this is a FI section so I GOTTA bash all the All Motor girls in here!!!!!!!!!!!!! FI OWNZ YOU ALL! Come over to the darkside!!!

JUST KIDDING GIRLS...I love you all!

Congrats on the car and you will absolutely love the Boost when you do it right. Everyone I have taken for rides they grin go from ear to ear. I might be able to help if you want a set-up. I'm thinking of selling my car at the end of summer or a lil before so i'll be parting out my kit and putting it back to stock. e-mail me for details import2ner@msn.com I can make a vid of how she flies. As for the tranny I do run a gs-r for more top end, but do miss the lsd.

peace