ITRCA

Okay, so i'm in need of some venting. 1.) the dealership i bought my beloved ITR from was tasked (weds of last week) to correct a few MINOR things. i.e. a plastic bumper clip, a few plastic hood gasket push clips, a door pin, a cracked brake light, and find out what's wrong w/ 3rd gears synchro, and a few other small odds and ends. Well i pull back in the following weds (yesterday) and i call to check on the status. And hoping to be able to pick up my car....Well...i called the tranny shop and they told me that they JUST recieved the car this morning. WTF? So i call back to the dealership. And the guy who i talked with (THE MANAGER) about all the little repairs and corrections, is "IN FLORIDA ON A VACATION at the moment, would you like me to leave a message for when he gets back?" *^@!$ NO, you $^$% %^!^!!!!! I seriously went ape shat on the receptionist. I had even dropped the car off 2 days before i was supposed to. 2 whole @#^$^! days. They had a total of 9 !$^!*#^@ days to complete this work and it is JUST NOW getting dropped off. What's even worse is that they're trying to make it sound like it's MY fault. %&^@ that shat! Owwww how i'd like to just go down there right now and start throw people through some walls. How much of a $^%&@! tool do you have to be to hold off on SCHEDULED repairs on a customers vehicle! No, this isn't an Acura dealership...it was some half-bit POS dealership. I'm so #&!$%&% @^&*^$%! right now. Now they're trying to make ME pay ALL the repair and labor costs. %&@$ THAT. I have a good mind to just file a complaint with the state and make THEM pay it. @^*!^% a whole new transmission. The guy at the shop said that it would be cheaper for me to just find another or re-manned transmission......if only it were that simple. Then the guy goes off on some tangent about how he won't have a problem finding one. I TOLD his that it's not some mundane, everyday, run of the mill Integra. That it's a TYPE-R. I'm not looking for a GSR or LS tranny. I want the TYPE-R. He's like "well the hardest tranny i've ever come across to find was one for a the Dodge Stealth R/T, the twin turbo one. And i was able to find 1 of 4 in the US"... what the &$^# ever man....I hope the man's right and he can find one. This is !%U^%##* bull &%@!. Now i'm out 2 cars that pretty much useless to me for the time being. I JUST WANNA PUNCH SOMEONE IN THE THROAT!!!!!!!1

How did this turn out?

You seem to be upset. If it makes you feel better I have 5 brand new ITR transmission. PN#20011-P80-J41 just chilling.

len wrote:You seem to be upset. If it makes you feel better I have 5 brand new ITR transmission. PN#20011-P80-J41 just chilling.

How much for just 1?

From my bed I can see the recipt... but my price is just that f00

i'm stuck with the GSR non-LSD tranny...come to find that i didn't buy the car with the ITR tranny...therefore the extended warranty that i bought with the car doesn't and will not cover the ITR tranny only the GSR one. If that makes any sense to you guys. Yeah, i'm still infuriated with it. I'm still not sure that i'm going to do....

Hey how much are you asking for one of those ITR trannies? Would you be willing to part with just one of the LSD's and not a whole tranny? Hit me up and let me know. Thanks

Forgive the extended absense all. The workloads about tripled on me in the past month of so. We're ramping up for an upcoming deployment (Aug) so we're trying to get as much done now so he have some time to spent at home with family and friends before we have to leave. But hopefully things will go a little slower here within the next week or so.

If you are asking to buy one of my trans, sorry they are not for sale.

As for getting a LSD, call up Len and see what the price is or try searching the classifieds.

how do you tell ur itr tranny have lsd? arn't both tire spin at the same time?

^^ jack the front end of the car up and spin the one tire by hand... if both tires spin the SAME direction then it has an LSD....if not, then no, it's an "open" (non-LSD)differential.

...that's how it was explained to me by a good friend.

is that right?... are u sure?

95% sure.......

does anyone need the purpose of a LSD explained to them? i will be glad to do so if anyone needs. I have a pretty good grasp of their concept....

Hold up...

The ITR LSD will NOT fit in a GS-R trans.

It will in a B16... but not the GS-R trans. IMO... sell the trans and purchase a used ITR trans.

Dave_B wrote:The ITR LSD will NOT fit in a GS-R trans.

It will in a B16... but not the GS-R trans.

Incorrect. ITR LSD will fit in any Hydro b-series trans case (except RT-awd crv - without modification) with either tapered or ball bearing differential bearings. B16 (4.40) & LS (4.26) ring gear will not bolt up to the ITR LSD. GSR (4.40) ring gear will bolt up fine.

I'm not sure if you're smiley was sarcasm or not... but the info you posted is incorrect.

^^^i never said that it would or would not fit. I know that there are GS-R's with a factory installed LSD, as well as Type-R's with a factory installed LSD...never said they were or were not interchangeable...never said i was trying to put a Type-R LSD in a GS-R tranny. I'm just trying to find a stock Type-R tranny with all it's bells and whistle intact.

D wrote:

Dave_B wrote:The ITR LSD will NOT fit in a GS-R trans.

It will in a B16... but not the GS-R trans.

Incorrect. ITR LSD will fit in any Hydro b-series trans case (except RT-awd crv - without modification) with either tapered or ball bearing differential bearings. B16 (4.40) & LS (4.26) ring gear will not bolt up to the ITR LSD. GSR (4.40) ring gear will bolt up fine.

I'm not sure if you're smiley was sarcasm or not... but the info you posted is incorrect.

So let me get this right (different from what I have read/heard over the years) it will bolt into the GS-R trans with NO MODIFICATIONS? I've always heard it different that the number of bolts in the ring gear is different on the GS-R but that the B16 trans it was a bolt in affair.

More info please.

Dave_B wrote:More info please.

LS = 4.26 FD - Small ID ring gear
B16 = 4.40 FD - Small ID ring gear
Both above use the same size smaller B16/LS diff

GSR - 4.40 FD - Large ID ring gear
USDM ITR - 4.40 FD - Large ID ring gear
JDM 98 spec - 4.78 FD - Large ID ring gear (also, JDM 1st gear/CS has different diameter/needle bearings)
Above 3 all use the same size larger B series diff

All of the above can be interchanged into a Hydro B-series trans case with little effort. Either the old style (somewhere pre 98) tapered bearings, or the newer style ball bearings and appropriate 80mm shims/spacers can be used.

RTAWD CRV 5 speed - Dual ring gears, differential is not interchangable with any other B series without a machine shop..... Sooner or later (hopefully this winter) a GSR/ITR OBX lsd to one of my CRV trans for the mini.

I'm not sure about the B17A GSR diff off the top of my head, cable actuated B series case.... i'm pretty sure it's the same as the B16. YS1 trans is a cable trans with Hydro close ratio gearset... can be interchanged with any hydro B series case.

Anything else?

Yes, is that OD, not ID?

And given close diameters, again I thought it was bolt holes, not the diameter. One would think, you can have a smaller diameter, yet still line up the bolt holes (given that it's not to much smaller and there is still ample room for those holes in question)

But again... I was always under the impression it was more the bolt holes on the ring gear that was the problem and not the diameter of that gear.

Dave_B wrote:Yes, is that OD, not ID?

And given close diameters, again I thought it was bolt holes, not the diameter. One would think, you can have a smaller diameter, yet still line up the bolt holes (given that it's not to much smaller and there is still ample room for those holes in question)

But again... I was always under the impression it was more the bolt holes on the ring gear that was the problem and not the diameter of that gear.

huh? ID/OD...... the differential has a smaller OD (and is physically smaller), the ring gear has a smaller ID. pick one.

They're not close at all, the B16/LS ring gear will NOT fit over the GSR/ITR diff. Period. The bolt circle is also smaller, so if you wish to use that as your justification... sure. The ring gear has a chamfered edge on the ID, and a close tolerance fit to the corresponding lip on the differential housing. They are not interchangeable.

I have seen some other OEM differentials that aren't 10 bolt... i have yet to have my hands on one of these 14 bolt diff's... and i have yet to see a DC2 ring gear with 14 bolts on it either. shrug.


Edit: The final drive ratio is not related to the size of the differential....... the 4.40 B16 ring gear has the same OD as the 4.40 ITR/GSR OD. Understand? (edited previous post for clarity also)

D wrote:

Dave_B wrote:Yes, is that OD, not ID?

And given close diameters, again I thought it was bolt holes, not the diameter. One would think, you can have a smaller diameter, yet still line up the bolt holes (given that it's not to much smaller and there is still ample room for those holes in question)

But again... I was always under the impression it was more the bolt holes on the ring gear that was the problem and not the diameter of that gear.

huh? ID/OD...... the differential has a smaller OD (and is physically smaller), the ring gear has a smaller ID. pick one.

They're not close at all, the B16/LS ring gear will NOT fit over the GSR/ITR diff. Period. The bolt circle is also smaller, so if you wish to use that as your justification... sure. The ring gear has a chamfered edge on the ID, and a close tolerance fit to the corresponding lip on the differential housing. They are not interchangeable.

I have seen some other OEM differentials that aren't 10 bolt... i have yet to have my hands on one of these 14 bolt diff's... and i have yet to see a DC2 ring gear with 14 bolts on it either. shrug.


Edit: The final drive ratio is not related to the size of the differential....... the 4.40 B16 ring gear has the same OD as the 4.40 ITR/GSR OD. Understand? (edited previous post for clarity also)

D... Matt... Take the attitude to the side for a moment... i'm asking for clearification of something which I have been told from many of reputable sources over the years...

That said... i was asking how the ring gear is measured... by the ID, or OD. Given what your saying, it's the ID where the problem is (where the diff housing mates to the ring gear)

I understand now what your saying... the diff will not fit in the ID of the ring gear. It has always been told to me, it's the number of bolts that is the problem. Let me ask you this then... can you change the ring gear in the B16 trans to that of the ITR trans? To eliminate the ID clearence issue?

Didn't confuse the ratio for diameter at all. And understood where the problem lies, it's the diameter of the ID of the ring gear to diff housing. But again, can you swap the ITR/GSR ring gear into a B16 trans and make it work?

Dave_B wrote:D... Matt... Take the attitude to the side for a moment... i'm asking for clearification of something which I have been told from many of reputable sources over the years...

I'm trying to help you out here... don't get your panties in a bunch buddy.

go check out quaiffe/obx/any aftermarket diff... it will come in 2 sizes, large (GSR/ITR) and small (B16/LS/GS/RS). The corresponding sized ring gear goes to that diff.

Dave_B wrote: Let me ask you this then... can you change the ring gear in the B16 trans to that of the ITR trans? To eliminate the ID clearence issue?

But again, can you swap the ITR/GSR ring gear into a B16 trans and make it work?

If you wish to change out the 4.40 small diameter ring gear/diff in a b16 transmission to a 4.40 from an ITR/GSR, you will also need a GSR/ITR differential. If you wish to put in a LS 4.26 FD, all you need to do is swap the ring gear and countershaft. The LS ring gear bolts up to the B16 diff.

D wrote:

Dave_B wrote:D... Matt... Take the attitude to the side for a moment... i'm asking for clearification of something which I have been told from many of reputable sources over the years...

I'm trying to help you out here... don't get your panties in a bunch buddy.

go check out quaiffe/obx/any aftermarket diff... it will come in 2 sizes, large (GSR/ITR) and small (B16/LS/GS/RS). The corresponding sized ring gear goes to that diff.

Dave_B wrote: Let me ask you this then... can you change the ring gear in the B16 trans to that of the ITR trans? To eliminate the ID clearence issue?

But again, can you swap the ITR/GSR ring gear into a B16 trans and make it work?

If you wish to change out the 4.40 small diameter ring gear/diff in a b16 transmission to a 4.40 from an ITR/GSR, you will also need a GSR/ITR differential. If you wish to put in a LS 4.26 FD, all you need to do is swap the ring gear and countershaft. The LS ring gear bolts up to the B16 diff.

It's the internet... panties aren't on, nor would get bunched... attitude and perception do get in the way of explanations at time...

So then, if I gather correctly from what your saying... I can take a B16 trans, and swap the dif and ring gear and be ok, no issues at all with clearence or fitment?

If that is so, maybe that is the missing part of the "story" I've always heard of the ITR dif working in a B16 trans.

Thanks for the clearification. Now get that other R built...

Dave_B wrote:So then, if I gather correctly from what your saying... I can take a B16 trans, and swap the dif and ring gear and be ok, no issues at all with clearence or fitment?

Correct. All B series hydro cases are the same (except of course the CRV AWD unit - dual ring gears, cable actuated shift, starter rotated to front side of bellhousing) so the ITR LSD will fit fine in any B16/LS/GSR case with the corresponding differential bearings (and all of which can be converted to the newer style carrier ball bearings).

Dave_B wrote:Now get that other R built...

Just dropped the motor in last weekend, axels are going in tonight along with welding up the shift linkage. Waiting on some parts to arrive at local dealer. Might get to do startup within the week.

D wrote:

Dave_B wrote:So then, if I gather correctly from what your saying... I can take a B16 trans, and swap the dif and ring gear and be ok, no issues at all with clearence or fitment?

Correct. All B series hydro cases are the same (except of course the CRV AWD unit - dual ring gears, cable actuated shift, starter rotated to front side of bellhousing) so the ITR LSD will fit fine in any B16/LS/GSR case with the corresponding differential bearings (and all of which can be converted to the newer style carrier ball bearings).

Dave_B wrote:Now get that other R built...

Just dropped the motor in last weekend, axels are going in tonight along with welding up the shift linkage. Waiting on some parts to arrive at local dealer. Might get to do startup within the week.

Well shit... I've got a "broken" GS-R trans... and was thinking it wasn't worth tracking down parts for it. LS swap with GS-R/LSD equiped trans for the hatch might be on the list to do shortly. Thanks for the info/clearification.

I've heard she looks great. Anything else she needs to be road worthy? Speaking of D's infamous projects... how's the mini coming?

Dave_B wrote:I've heard she looks great. Anything else she needs to be road worthy? Speaking of D's infamous projects... how's the mini coming?

I have most of the parts for the rebuild, missing ABS fuse box, door pannels, carpet, and some other misc crap. Mini has more parts laying around.. trying to get ITR2 and wagovan running by winter. Play with the mini hopefully soonish.